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Discussion in 'DIY Speakers and Subwoofers' started by Matt Grant, Nov 7, 2012.
Yes I am building the one with the Lpad for adjustability. I am beginning on the XO's now. ;D
So I've completed a pair of test XO's and have been listening to them for the past few days now. I'm just blown away by the clarity and the dynamics of this combo. They are just so effortless!!
They have been playing in my living room next to my Ewave minis using the Beta 8a and XT120 horns. The Faital/DNA360 in comparison sounds cleaner and will play to much higher levels without even breaking a sweat although the Ewaves sounded much cleaner and louder when compared to a great DIY design such as the Nat P's that I had previously in my living room. Thanks so much for the XO design MTG!!
I'm going to try and set up a kit with those because I forgot that MCM Electronics carries Faital Pro and is within driving distance. I'm not sure exactly where it is, but I think it's close to PE.
tsolms, don't forget to put a review up for those compression drivers and the waveguides. We really need reviews of all this stuff.
Really glad you like them, I was starting to get worried for a little bit. Out of curiosity were do you have the lpad's set to? Also how do you think they compare to the active setup you had before?
Erich he has them on QSC weaveguides ;D
But we need reviews of the compression drivers too.
Erich, MCM doesn't have a storefront anymore. I'm not sure they even have a pick up window, you might have to have it delivered. (And its quite a way from PE, too).
I see U pick the p-core inductor. Do U find it better than the I core. Thanks
@mtg90, unfortunately, the imageshack pictures are not showing.
Could you please verify if it would be possible for you to update the images?
Thank you very much.
I'm sorry to insist, but does anyone has the crossover details for this build?
I do have the XO info available yet. If you'd like it shoot me a PM with your email address and I can send it to you.
Thank you very much in advance.
Are you able to provide the crossover schematic for this design pls? Seems a great shame not to have it posted for more people to try.
Fixed the dead images on the original post.
Fab, thanks heaps Matt. This is going to be my first full range build. I'd love to do a DIY Sound Group kit but shipping to Australia for me is just too expensive. Faital Pro is locally available at a very reasonable price so I'm happy to have found this great design. Thanks again!
I'm just about to purchase crossover parts and noticed that you have specified 20 and 25 watt ratings for the 4 and 10 ohm resistors respectively.
I've only been able to find 10 watt resistors locally however and I'm wondering if using these lower wattage units would be a problem?
10w resistors should be fine unless you plan on driving them at high power levels for long periods of time.
One question... the SEOS waveguide can be replaced with another one or not? DIYSG is out of stock of 12" waveguides for a while now... Retail waveguide probably are not as good as SEOS, but the would work? or you need to change XO also?
After chancing upon a related build thread I saw someone just parallel up resistors of double the value to get the desired values. I think I'll do this to stay truer to your design.
I have a similar problem to mga2009 in that the DNA360 has been out of stock for a long time. I understand that the SEOS 10 is highly interchangeable with the 12?
But I'm hoping that you might have a suggestion for an affordable DNA360 substitute. I've read that the
PRV Audio D290Py-B might be an option? Any suggestions highly appreciated.
tsloms seems to be using the QSC PL-00446GP which it's not in stock at PE. The PRV WG35-25-B seems to be a clone of the QSC, but it's also out of stock. Finally the B-52 PHRN-1014 1" Horn 10"x14" (which is in stock at PE) seems it is also a clone from the QSC...
The thing is... IDK if you have to modify the XO to use that waveguide.
Regarding the Denovo DNA360, which is also out of stock, I've read this was designed with the B&C DE250 as starting point, but the DNA360 goes lower and higher and they are individually tested by Erich to assure correct measurement. I am not doubting the italian assembled quality of the B&C, but DIYSG seems to be more "personalized". Sadly, it is constantly out of stock.
I've read another CD similar to the DE-250 are these: Dayton Audio D250P, PRV Audio BE280, PRV Audio D290Py, Soundwave SE250, JC Speaker BP-44B, Erisson Audio T44-K-10, Paroyal DE250, BMY DE250-8 and Guanhong GD-BP44B.- These probably won't measure as well as the B&C nor the DENOVO DNA360.
Again, IDK if the XO need's to be changed if using these CD. I can probably buy the Faital Driver, the PRV CD and the B52 waveguide and use the same XO shown by Matt, and see what would happend and then I could upload some results taken with my Umik (calibrated by cross spectrum), but I don't have the knowledge to do so.
Those QSC wave guides and its clones are used on the deluxe Econowaves without modifying the crossovers. Therefore the B-52 ought to be a drop in, no mod swap.
I've been looking looking around for alternative CD's for months. I can get the B&C DE250 but I'd like to try and access one of the clones. EarlK recomends the Celestion CDX1-1747 or CDX1-1745 as replacements over on the Econowave thread. He does qualify this statement by adding:
"The CDX1-1745 & CDX1-1747 are functionally close to the de250 / but I didn't say they're interchangeable. Using either of those Celestions ( on say a 152i > clone ) will require a smidge more HF compensation than the de250 does ( on the Deluxe filter, as a for instance ). That translates into a slightly larger HF cap of about 1.5uF - 2.0uF extra capacitance ( across the inline resistor )."
The other comments I found regard the PRV Audio D290Py-B in the reviews section at PE where a customer states:....
"Suitable for replacing B&C DE250
Of the many 1" polyimide compression drivers "inspired" by the B&C DE250, the PRV Audio D290Py is probably equal to the best, and is certainly the best value. Working from someone else's 2-way 12" woofer and waveguide design, I substituted the D290Py for a similar, slightly more expensive driver I suspect rolls of the same factory floor as the PRV, and I couldn't be happier. I'd recommend it as the go-to driver for all new Econowave-style home speaker designs, and a very good choice for pro audio, as well."
mga2009, which ever way you go please do post your results and experiences back here! Also keen to hear how you get on with your measuring mic
Hi Matt G.
Hoping you might have a perspective, opinion or options here ?
Good to know they are used in the Econowave Deluxe! sadly, in my country I can't get my hands on the Eminence Deltalite 12".- Deltalite 10" and Kappalite 3012LF are available. The latter costs around USD$260, a little bit more than the Faital 12PR300, so I would really like to build this design by Matt, and just buy the DNA360 and 12" Waveguide from DIYSG and get the Faital locally (just to avoid super high shipping prices).
I will post if I pull the trigger on the B52 waveguides and PRV CD.-
I'm in almost exactly the same position as you. The Faital woofers are available locally for a relatively affordable price, the DNA360 isn't available, but I was very lucky to snag a pair of unused SEOS 12 locally for a bargain from a fella that had imported them and then had a change of plans.
So I've now ordered my crossover parts but I'm still to settle on a CD.
Hoping Matt G. will chime in here soon to settle the matter for me and put me out of my planning paralysis pain! ;-)
Inspired by Econowave. Credit to Matt Grant.
Will a single 4" diameter port work with this? And would a length of 4.5" be ok or is a 4" length preferable?
Also, would the B&C DE250 on Wayne's H290C be suitable?
Single 4" diameter port at 4" should be fine.
You could probably get away with substituting in a DE250 for the DNA-360 but the SEOS-12 and H290C are not interchangeable.