OK... the 580s are ok....like the sb2000...but for all the hype they both get im not sure what people are comparing them to. Someone said theyve had all sorts of speakers including Altec 19s and with the 580s, their search is over. I'm not that lucky. And since this setup seems to sound best with the sub crossed at 60hz, maybe 40hz isn't that important either. Aside from having a factory black ash vinyl finishand looking like they mean business when the neighbors pop up to inform me that they can hear them, I'm not sure what they would do better than a helix and the helix looks like it could be squished right up to the wall next to the TV if it got built with side ports. The next purchase was going to be a used receiver with xt32 to get all the speakers marching in unison. Will wait for ALL the 8k standards to be settled for 2 years before replacing it with a new one. So after all that, the important question would be...Why are these the best sounding speakers? Are the 15s that much better sounding than the 12s because they look like they might be too big for this little room. Will they have an annoyingly noticeable missing gap in sound between the tweeter and woofer like my 2 way mass market speakers? I **really** don't want to buy another set of speakers for at least several months but if these speakers are the best that will be available in the foreseeable future because nobody bought them when they were listed, maybe i should see if any are left in the back room? I hate to come on the Forums to directly waste Erich & Matt's time because they've done everything every step of the way to make this possible, but they also have the rare first hand experience with enough speakers that they can make comparisons that other people can just guess at. Honestly, without this forum drawing attention to it, I would never have thought of looking for big coaxial speakers. In a very 2+2=22 way, i just figured that "seperates" are supposed to sound better than coaxial car door speakers so the same probably applied to a house.